Dr. Dan Lyons is a 1996 graduate of Palmer College of chiropractic in Davenport Iowa. While attending Palmer, he participated in the Troxell intern program and served as head intern for three semesters. He graduated from the Palmer Legion of Chiropractic Philosophers, LCP (Hon), inaugural program in August 2000, and the ICA’s inaugural Diplomate in Philosophical Chiropractic Standards (DPhCS) program in November 2005. In October of 2023 he was honored by being made a Distinguished Fellow of the Philosophy of Chiropractic. You may know him from his work with the Gonstead Methodology Institute, Gonstead Clinical Studies Society or the Center for Chiropractic Progress or from one of his speaking engagements. In addition to being in private practice since 1996, he has been intimately involved with the Gonstead Methodology Institute, as a lead instructor, as well as serving as Executive Director, Vice President, President and Treasurer. He became a Gonstead Clinical Studies Society Diplomate in 2008 and a board member in 2012.

For over 27 years, Dr Lyons has been a noteworthy speaker and leader in the Chiropractic profession. He is best known for entertaining his audiences by combining our philosophy, science and art in the way they were intended to be taught. When he is not traveling to present to Chiropractors across the world (which is more often than not) he resides in Green Bay Wisconsin with his wife, Dr. Brookh Lyons. He enjoys spending time with his wife and two children as well as hunting, fishing and reading.

TRANSCRIPT

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  You made it to Chiro Hustle! Sit back and learn from the greatest influencers in the profession on the world's number one chiropractic podcast. Before we dive into this powerful episode, please remember to subscribe to our channels and give us a 5-star rating on iTunes to continue hustling.

This episode is brought to you by…

ChiroHD – More than an EHR; Practice Management, Simplified.

EVO Creative Media – A boutique, high quality video content co-op.

The Chiro Hustle Podcast is sponsored by ChiroHD, EVO Creative Media, 100% Chiropractic, Chiro Health USA, Imaging Services, Chiro Moguls, New Patients in a Box, PureChiroNotes, Titronics, Sherman College of Chiropractic, Life Chiropractic College West, Pro Hockey Chiropractic Society, Pro Baseball Chiropractic Society, and the IFCO.

Now, if you're looking to increase contributions toward preserving The Sacred Trust within the Chiropractic Subluxation model; in a way that honors our Innate and Universal Intelligence but lack the time and energy to launch a new initiative? Then, check out our Patreon page and choose the option that best fits your ability and desire to invest toward The Big Idea in support and restoration of freedoms to speech, medical and family health.

Now let’s hustle!

LUKE MILLETT (PRODUCER):  Hey guys, welcome to episode 592 of the Chiro Hustle Podcast. I'm your producer, Luke Millett, and here's your host, James Chester.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  So today we had the opportunity of interviewing Dr. Dan Lyons. If you want to hear a great message about science, philosophy, and art of chiropractic, stay tuned. This is another episode of the Chiro Hustle Podcast. Today's the end lions. We're going to talk about Gonstead we're going to talk about.  The diplomat of philosophy and chiropractic students and new practitioners. And then we're going to jump into social media mainstream versus reality mainstream. It's going to be a really great conversation today. Dan's on with episode 592. But before we jump into this episode, I let you know that they go, why? Why do we do it? We do over here. It's kind of our anchor statement. Freedom of speech. It's very important. We've never censored anyone. Really cool. I love that about us. I can't say the same about every other media outlet out there. Medical freedom. I think that people did a bit more discovery on that topic. They'd realize how important it is to them to have freedom of choice for how they take care of them and their family. So chiropractic is something that stands in that gap and protects that. So that's one of the reasons that we support medical freedom and freedom of choice and family health freedom. Because they're not the same thing. And you should have a choice of how you raise your family. And hopefully there's chiropractic involved with that. More philosophical, we do protect P.J. Palmer's Sacred Trust. It's a very important part of the mantel piece of chiropractic. And if you guys don't know what that means, go back and do some research and stop this interview and find P.J. Palmer's last word. You're going to know more about chiropractic than you ever did previously. I guarantee you, even if you're a chiropractor, you're right before it. We support subluxation-based chiropractic. I know that we shouldn't have to say that, but a lot of the schools are taking that out of there. Not the schools that support us. Sherman and Life West, they actually sponsor our show. So thank you Sherman and Life West. And then we do believe in any intelligence or universal intelligence. We believe that when a man in the physical or a woman in the physical gets adjusted, it connects them to the spiritual. And that's a big idea. And I think that that's predicates what this podcast stands for, is the big idea of chiropractic. So with that, Dan Lyons, welcome to the show.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Thanks for having me, Jim. It's a long time coming.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Yeah, I'm excited for your projects too. You know, I know you're talking about doing some stuff to help educate and nurture the ideas around students and new practitioners.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Yeah, we got to get them up and running faster. Just a lot of debt compared to when I went to school nearly 30 years ago. And not much has changed outside. And that's why I think one of the reasons we see so many people just doing something other than chiropractic, you said, subluxation, centered chiropractic. If you take subluxation out, you don't have chiropractic. I don't understand. I never really understood that phrase. He wants to bring in their peripheral. He got a couple of spoons over here. They want to rub on people. And you know, he got the now everybody's doing functional medicine. You know, I'm sure they help a lot of people, but we need just good old-fashioned, serious chiropractic.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, I think we follow trends. And the reason I believe that people are going functional medicine route is because they're following the trends that people are more sick than ever. But they're also blending in chiropractic with that message. And I don't think it's for every chiropractor, but I do think that they should definitely consider staying subluxation centered and making that like the main thing, the main thing.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  The main thing's always got to be the main thing. You know, I always said, you know, if you want to have PT in your clinic, great, higher PT. So you don't have to do it. You don't have to take any of the focus off that. And you know, you know, I'm sure I take some supplements because I'm hedging my bets. You know, there's a lot of science out there and you have to kind of experiment on yourself and see what works. But you know, if you want, I have always said I wanted to live to be 120 and I beat my body up quite a bit. So I want to make it to 120 is functional. So I need to do whatever it is in addition to chiropractic care. I just got my adjustment this, my weekly adjustment this morning to make sure I get there. But I don't want to take my focus off of what I do, which is locating, analyzing and correcting vertebral subluxation.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  I'm going to play that clip a million times. All right. I'm just going to cut that one clip and we're going to, we're going to, we're going to make that like the most sensational clip of chiropractic of 2024. I love it. Yeah. Because it's what every chiropractic needs to hear. And it comes from a place of power and confidence. And I think that that's something when this debt load is there and it's on these new grads. It's hard for them to focus outside of that zone because it is, it's a very big monster that follows them.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  It is. And you know, I think that we forget that there is nothing more powerful than, you know, universal intelligence and universal forces. And then we have, except kind of, innate intelligent because for the 70, 80, 90, 100, maybe 120 years we have, an intelligence keeps our body together and functioning in violation of, you know, the universal laws of thermodynamics. I mean, everything wants to go to its lowest energy state as fast as it can. But for those years we're alive. They're given, you know, those universal forces, the big chiropractic index finger.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  You know, I think what you're talking about just really, it's, it's vitalism. And we're talking earlier about like when people start to age and they're not progressively performing anymore, quality of life starts to become an issue. And that's the thing with the chiropractic profession. Like it does get people a chance to at least have a better quality of life. You know, when the cliches have always heard as it gives life to years and years to life. And I believe that. But at a certain point, there is limitations of matter and our bodies start to deteriorate at a certain, a certain path. So I think it's really important for people to understand like the conversations that were happening today about subluxation based chiropractic. Like the reason people don't thrive long term is because they're subluxated. And their bodies are not performing at its high its ability to function and to produce.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  So absolutely. And you know, and they're poisoned realistically. I mean, we eat, you know, what is it like 80 per 86% of the food we eat. I think I just heard on a podcast is processed, you know, and processed food is, you know, basically ground up. There's a lot more surface areas. So it's absorbed a lot easier. And there's all those chemicals in there. But the difference between, you know, anybody can change their own diet. That is really health care. It's what you do for yourself. So exercising, making sure you're eating real food, live food and, you know, live food spoils in a day or two. If you let it sit out, can that open? Let's sit there. It goes there. Put a stake out on the table for a couple of days. You don't want to eat it. But if the shelf life's longer, then it's really not good for you. But that's something that you do for yourself. You can't adjust yourself. You need to go see your chiropractor to do that. And that's the biggest thing. We need to get the world to understand. I mean, what is it? When we were in at Mile High this year, and Kennedy was speaking, he said that we are United States is 4% of the world's population. Yet we have 86% of the world's chronic disease. And maybe it was 68% of the chronic disease. I don't remember exactly. But we have hugely disproportionate. And it's because we've done a crap largely.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, I'm just going to follow up on that. But I don't want to lose track of talking about the Gonstead part of your career and how you got into chiropractic. So I will say that you're all right about the food. They once said that we are what we eat eats. And I think that if you consider that, and then if it's processed down, you're really getting not much. So I think that that's really important for us to at least anchor down and know. You can make better health decisions by what you put into this, what you put into these, and what you put into these. Exactly. What you allow to come in your mouth, like food, like what you eat, like we have to be more considered of that, especially not.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  And it can only use what it has at its disposal. So if you're feeding it crappy stuff, then you don't get the quality, you're going to get the best quality product you can, but it may not be what you want.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  The fuel source is diminished. So 27 years in chiropractic Dan.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Almost 28 now. Almost 28. Where we started talking about doing this, it was closer to 27. I'll be, it'll be 28 years in February.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Okay. So you're along this journey, 28 years. What was your initial spark to say, I'm going to go be a chiropractor?

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Oh, man. You know, I don't, I don't, everyone says my story is better than I think it is, but so I originally was trying to decide between going into pro wrestling and medicine. And I know those are very similar fields. And then I, I broke my neck in a car accident and it wasn't a big thing. You know, as we were going 25 miles an hour and we hit a stop car and I had my head turned and my, I hit the roof and I broke C four and two spots, C five and three spots, completely dislocated five on six, crushed my spinal cord and still walked out of the, the emergency room before my buddy who had a little whiplash and some cuts on his hands. It put me in a collar, sent me home and the next morning I hurt and someone's wrong and they told me, you know, I might have some ligament damage and I should probably see a neurosurgeon and I had a hard collar on. But in the week before I ended up having my surgery, I lost like 50 pounds. I just shriveled. My friends from the gym would come over and go, dude, we can watch your arm shrink as I'm sitting here and like, shut up, get out of here. So I went head surgery. The surgeon was, you know, very good. There were, when I was at Palmer, there were times I'd pick up an issue of spine and there was, he had authored every article in the issue. So a prolific surgeon. But he was just a jerk and with my 22 year old, 21 year old, Croc brain, still going, I associated medicine with you. If you're going to be great, you got to be a jerk. And so I didn't want to do that. And then I remembered my chiropractor who I saw growing up and he was a nice guy. He really knew everybody, his, his travel card, you know, was like, this is the sheet you sent me on things. It'd be like your name and a bunch of little, you know, listings and ticks off on what he did. But he knew everything about everybody. You know, he knew the families and everything because you could hear through the walls because his walls were also that thick and he did well for himself and I called him up and he said, yes, I think absolutely you should go to Palmer and be a chiropractor. So you know, the rest, as they say, is history. And then I, my, so I walk into Palmer. I'm six, six. I think at that point I was back up to probably like 245, 250 pounds and I had long hair. It was halfway between my shoulders and my waist. I had a big skeleton dangling earring or something, snakeskin boots and I walk in and a couple of guys that I'm still, you know, very close friends with, they're like, that guy's terrifying. We need to make sure he's a friend. And they invited me out to a workshop and I said, I can't go this week. I'll go next week. And because I already promised someone else that the gal that got me to go to Palmer, I was going to go to a workshop that she was involved in. And it was the same workshop and it was a Troxel intern program and, you know, teaching Gonstead. And you know, that's kind of my introduction to Gonstead, which is funny because I grew up 22 miles from the Gonstead in clinic. The first time I ever golfed was at the golf course right next to the Gonstead clinic. And I'd been in the room when my parents got adjusted by Gonstead and don't remember that. And I remember all kinds of dumb stuff from being a kid. So it's kind of like the universe, I guess, you know, the universe is kind of saying, Hey, hey, you should be a Gonstead chiropractor. And I just never saw it.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  So as I'm thinking about like everything you're saying of getting into chiropractic surgery, recovery, I am curious about what you did to do in recovery. But I'm also really curious about the why Gonstead said so important as a technique to chiropractors.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  All right. So what did I do to recover? Yes.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  And then surgery? Yeah, because I think a lot of people, you know, they think that chiropractic is the only thing that they'll ever need in their lifetime.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Oh, yeah.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, I mean, our audience, our audience, but like, yeah, sometimes we get injured and we have to recover.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Yeah, I'm actually in January, I'm teaching a class on, you know, working through injuries, you know, because you get hurt as a human being. And then you got to go to the office and see patients.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  And so we never talk about that. We never talk about recovery.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Yeah. You know, I was young. I was 21 and a half, 22. So I mean, I did what every 22 year old does, you know, I drank some beer and I did all the wrong things. I probably could have recovered much better and much faster, but you're already so bullet proof at that age, you know, you don't think about it. And they didn't obviously didn't give me anything. You know, it was June 12, 1990s when I broke my neck and I started Chiropractic College two years later. So and I didn't know anything, you know, really about taking care of people with, with, you know, using and stuff because I have a four or five six fusion in my neck. And but it's, it's helped me having my fusion is helping care of other people. And, you know, it was interesting. I remember one time Greg Plager, a Gonstead Chiropractor out in San Francisco, who authored there's a Plager's purple book in the Gonstead world. It's called the Purple Book. And where the got it was like an updated chapters where they had everything in the Cartesian coordinates. So you got, you know, negative Theta Z and all that stuff in there. A lot of research where the old chapters from, you know, when Dr. Gonstead was live in the 60s, you know, it's just his findings. And Greg was doing a pediatric book at, and he was living at Palmer at the time and, and we helped him out with all the, with the film analyzation. And he, I had him come in and teach a class for the, for the students in the interns on spinal fractures. And it was really kind of unsettling to me because there was so many, I see these, these cases see the x-rays and I'm like, that's me, that's me, that's me. Where chiropractors were correcting dislocations and having, you know, better results. I had a bunch of fractures. They definitely would not have worked on me. But we do a lot of, we are capable of doing way more than, than definitely we're taught in school. And, you know, a lot of it are probably our malpractice providers would not be happy with us doing. And it is possible if you have a very specific and, and, and scientific approach as opposed to the, you know, kind of whack-a-mole stuff we see in TikTok’s all the time.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Yeah. I think you know a lot of important topics there. The specific, the specific adjustment style of Gonstead, you know, I've been in this profession for 15 years, you know, I, I don't really have to say anything kind or approving to anything. But what I've heard over my first 10 years was if a chiropractor was Gonstead that trained from Palmer, that was like the gold standard. And you know, I grew up in Davenport, Iowa. That was like Palmer land. So I, I grew up with a different standard of what chiropractic was too. Up until 15 years ago, I'm just being honest, I didn't even know there was another chiropractor at the College of the Palmer.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  I didn't. Yeah, I can, I can understand it. I mean, if you're at the mecca, so, you know, why would you think there's anything else

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  there? I just thought that every chiropractor should know Gonstead then they should be from Palmer.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  That's true. And you know, Gonstead, I have a lot of upper cervical friends, you know, and upper cervical chiropractors and Gonstead chiropractors, we, you know, we all agree on specificity. We all pretty much use x-ray. Most upper cervical chiropractors and all Gonstead chiropractors are going to use instrumentation. You know, I got a couple here. I got, you know, an EDL, an old EDL and the new X scope. I got one, two, three, four, five, six, seven old scopes sitting up on a shelf there.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Why, why, why do scopes matter so much?

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Because you have to find the interference to the mental impulse. And it's one of the ways that's expressed as heat and, you know, there's normal physiology and then there's abnormal physiology, but we really don't know which is which, you know, actually abnormal physiology, you could argue is normal for that individual at that time because they're subluxated. But the scope starts to make it more objective and you're starting to see, you know, there's, there's no reason that the, you should have a huge temperature difference side to side and there's no reason why you run that scope down that needle should continually jump unless there is a scar tissue or something, you know, blemish a pimple or something there. But as you learn how to use the instrument that helps you understand that and so you know that's not really a reading. So you have, you have to look at the philosophy world and I guess the Gonstead world and the subluxation centered world based world, we want to call it, we have an acronym for the subluxation is called MOPI, misalignment, occlusion, pressure, and interference. And you have to have all four of those there in order to be a subluxation. So you can have a misalignment that does not cause interference. Well, you don't have a subluxation, you don't want to adjust that. And you can have, you can have interference without a misalignment, but then again, that's not a subluxation, there's something else, there's a tumor, there's something else going on there that is not causing that interference. So we have to have a rubric, I guess you will, of this is how we know that there's a subluxation there. You can't just say, oh, this spot's high or this spot's sore, you know, which is a lot of what we do or stuck, there's a lot of reasons stuck. I remember when I was in school and I had long hair, one time I'm in a workshop and this guy's palpating my neck. And he's like, oh, this is really stuck. And I can feel his hands starting to slide around like he's going to adjust me. And I'm like, hold on a second there, cowboy. And I flip my hair up. I'm like, that's always going to be stuck. I don't want you to unstuck that part. That would be very bad for me in my quality of life. And so we have all those tools, you know, in a Gonstead world, there's a diagram that I use all the time, Dr. Phyllis Markham, one of my, she's like a grandmother to me. She's the one that got Dr. Gonstead to start teaching. And there's the subluxations at the center and you have the history and all chiropractors should take a history unless you work at the joint. You have instrumentation, you have static palpation, motion palpation, instrumentation, x-ray and visualization. I came up with one extra and I must have said one of them twice. But if all those things tell you that T12 subluxated, then you can be pretty darn sure that it's subluxated. And if they all say a different segment, then you should probably go back and start all over and see what you missed.

This episode is brought to you by…

ChiroHD – More than an EHR; Practice Management, Simplified.

EVO Creative Media – A boutique, high quality video content co-op.

The Chiro Hustle Podcast is sponsored by ChiroHD, EVO Creative Media, 100% Chiropractic, Chiro Health USA, Imaging Services, Chiro Moguls, New Patients in a Box, PureChiroNotes, Titronics, Sherman College of Chiropractic, Life Chiropractic College West, Pro Hockey Chiropractic Society, Pro Baseball Chiropractic Society, and the IFCO.

Now, if you're looking to increase contributions toward preserving The Sacred Trust within the Chiropractic Subluxation model; in a way that honors our Innate and Universal Intelligence but lack the time and energy to launch a new initiative? Then, check out our Patreon page and choose the option that best fits your ability and desire to invest toward The Big Idea in support and restoration of freedoms to speech, medical and family health.

Now let’s hustle!

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, one of my mentors, he would always tell me that if we go out of sequence, we have   to go back and repeat stuff a second time. And I think what you just done is a great explanation of the science of chiropractic and the objectivity of chiropractic and how you can locate it, detect it and then correct it.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  I mean, everything is applied now. You've explained the method, now it's applied. And I think that that's really cool. I think it's really important for people to hear that, especially the part that I want to get into next is like the philosophy. Why did you take an extra, because I mean, I read your bio, dude, it's like, if I had printed the whole thing up for as many speaking gigs as you've done, I'd probably run out of printer paper.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  There's a few there.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  But as I look through that, I'm like, and you decided to go get this diplomatic philosophy. So how did that all come into play and why is philosophy on that level important?

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Well, you know, I took a philosophy class in undergrad and I always loved it. And there's always something deeper. It's like that quote I read you about, if I may, I'll pull it back real quick. We are like books. Most people only see our cover. The minority read only the introduction. Many people believe the critics. Few will know our content from Emil Zola. Emil, if you're listening, love it. I don't know who Emil is. And I just found that the other day on the internet. But the, it's true. And philosophy is the only thing that really digs down and gets to the root of the subject. You're trying to intellectually break things down. Then you get to chiropractic college at Palmer and they say, chiropractic is the philosophy of science and art. Well, okay. So the quote starts with philosophy. So we got to go start studying philosophy. And so I, you know, you start reading the green books and start, you know, at the Palmer Archives, you can go in there and all the old PhDs, you can get a copy, a copy of all those PhDs. And you start reading these things and I'm like, man, I want a PhD. I want to be one of those guys. And so then all of a sudden, you know, Dr. Barge is at the school and they're offering this. And so my buddy, Eric Russell, he and I said, okay, we're going to do this. So we get down there and then we, you know, make some amazing friends. The, you know, I have friends throughout the profession, but really the closest people I have in the profession are the people I went through those three years of the philosophy diplomat with. And it solves so many problems. You know, the, the, the diagram that Dr. Phyllis created with the scoping and the X-ray and all that stuff. That's not a Gonstead thing. Yes, Gonstead doctors do use it, but everybody in the profession can get an X-ray machine, can, can buy a scope. That we all palpate. We all should take a history with all of eyes and can visualize. So we should all be doing those things. It's a chiropractic thing. And one of the things I teach a lot lately, teach at Sherman, you know, at their lyceum, regularly is Gonstead for the non-Gonstead chiropractor. And I'm basically trying to break down the tribalism and the walls and get everybody's, it's on the same page. If we all agree this is a subluxation, then that takes the confusion out from all the public. And then they're more open to chiropractic care.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  I think that's really, it's a standard. Yeah. And once you understand the standard of a technique and you understand the standard of analysis and then delivery, and then you have philosophy that roots it, that's a real fundamental approach. And that's really why I have a new on today and talk to you about Gonstead and the Diplomate program, was really, I think, important for our listeners just to hear that from you. Because, you know, after learning and going through that and seeing what happens and why those fundamentals are important to like, you know, own, like you have to own that. And that's what, to me, makes chiropractic special is those specific things that we talked about today. Yeah.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  I mean, and if you don't own your philosophy, then you struggle with the science and then you rely solely on the art. And that makes you, you know, a manual medicine practitioner. You know, our philosophy, it makes a promise on what is possible in the science, quantifies and validates it and shows what works and what doesn't. And then the art is how you deliver that promise of the philosophy. And it's just that continual cycle through there. And, you know, we need more philosophers. The, the Diplomate is, you know, it's a standalone year one that some people never go on and fully get the Diplomate. It take years two and three years, two and three. We start again this year in March. And when is this going to go out?

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  We pre-record six months of advance. So today this is live. We can share it. People can watch it. But you're actually edited. Episode comes out probably June.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Okay. Okay. So if you're watching live, you can sign up and, and go to Chiro progress.org and sign up, sign up before the end of the month before the end of the day, December 31st, you get $500 off years two and three. Class first classes in March. So you have until March to sign up.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, I think it's really cool. It's cool that people know that they can go and join and get their position within Chiro project to have philosophy and own it.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Yeah. And, and, you know, you're taught by, you know, all Diplomates that are dedicated. None of us get paid to do this. We, we, we go down there. We, we don't get, we, if we take time out of the office, we're not compensated for that. We do it because we love chiropractic and we want more chiropractors and we just finished last year. The, we graduated a Diplomate class that was held up by COVID. That was horrible. And because half the class was from out of the country and they couldn't come into the country. And we do these in person because it's so important to have that, that connection point. Like I said, my best friends in the profession are in that philosophy group. And if we were doing it online, you just don't get that. You don't get the same interaction. The ideas don't flow and you don't grow and learn as fast. But we had two LCP classes last year and a year before. And it looks like right now the current DIPLIT May class will probably have, you know, 30, I'm trying to get it up, up a little higher, but, you know, 30 other GANSDED chiropractors in that DIPLIT May class.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, I listened to the message and I think it's really strong and effective because we do need to create more powerful chiropractors that are have that, that method of mentality. It's really important that what you guys are doing actually is protecting the sacred trust. And what you guys are doing is actually supporting the things that our show stands for. And I think that I couldn't have a better guest on today to talk about these things. And just to be clear, like 60,000 people went to our website last month and listened to our shows. That's awesome. You know, just thinking about like this message that we're sharing today, getting to potentially 15 to 20,000 people that they wouldn't necessarily understand what chiropractic is. So we have to give it to them. You know, that's, that's, that's what this podcast has done over the past six and a half years. And we just consistently given it the message to people. And having your message today has been really awesome. What's close out with a couple of things. I know we wanted to talk about social media, virtual reality and helping the younger stage chiropractors understand chiropractic a little bit different from the other side. And how do you feel a little bit different from being new in the profession and what it means to, I guess, understand social media versus reality. Which we want to start with. Let's talk, let's talk to them about. I guess some ideas around being a new practitioner.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  So, you know, when I went to school, they would use the old line from the field of dreams, build it and they will come. And that's just not true. I mean, it never was true. It was a good line for a movie, but unless you are the, even if you're the only chiropractor in 100 miles, you put an office up, if they don't know who you are and what you do, they're not going to come. So, you have to get out and when I came up with my wife and I came up with this idea, you know, I'd asked Jim to be on the podcast, or the, our program. It's not really going to be a podcast, probably more like a Facebook membership type thing. But we've got to have people that understand how to communicate a message. You know, everybody, every time I'm speaking, I get up on my soapbox, they stop doing these dumb videos where you're making a bunch of popping noises. It doesn't help anybody. It scares people and there's always someone, well, I get a lot of new patients from it. I'm like, how many do you turn away? That'll never go see a chiropractor because they didn't like you, didn't like that. And there's, you're reducing what we do down to just the adjustment. The analysis that leads you to your adjustment is really the most important part of the visit. But you don't ever see a urologist or a gynecologist or a proctologist. You know, doing their, hey, come on in the office. Let me show you. This is Carol. This is Bob. It doesn't happen. We don't need to do that. There's so many better things we could do out there to promote chiropractic. So we got to get away from that. There's a positive and a negative and everybody's tied up. And while someone so is doing this, so and so is doing that, who cares? Worry about you. What are you doing? What good content are you producing? And don't worry about what it looks like they have. That's probably not what they have. And even if they have it and you want it, you've got to work for it. You don't watch it on a screen and say, man, I wish I had that. You got to get down there and work. And at some point, there's just good old-fashioned roll up your sleeves and get the work involved.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Yeah. You know, you under when people understand that it's not showing the work, you know, that's something that I even was asked many years ago, like should chiropractors make videos of themselves adjusting? Now it's become commonplace for you to be able to go and do a Google search. But even when Russell Brunson wrote his first book.com Secrets, I think, he had a buddy of mine, Chad Warner, who was his friend who was a chiropractor. And Russell was like, hey, man, I watched these videos on YouTube. And Russell was a wrestler. And he said, hey, I went and watched these videos of chiropractic on YouTube. And that went and adjusted all my team. And his buddy was the chiropractor, Chad Warner, was like, hey, man, you can't do that. Like, you can't watch what we do and go do that. And I think it's a real thing that people that have the wrong information and don't understand the practice of chiropractic, they get too much information is always not good. And I think when people see these x, y, z straps or whatever people are doing and just pulling on the spinal cord, that's not always the greatest idea either. And you shouldn't show people that constantly because it does sensationalize, but it is. It's not protected to the sacred trust. And it really is exposing chiropractic in an unnecessary fashion.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Every day, you know, I see patients that would most likely have severe or at least significant spinal trauma and damage if they had the ring dinger thing done, the y strap stuff done. But he never shows. This is how I determined this. This is something I can do for this patient. And I don't know. Maybe he doesn't. But he hasn't been sued that I know. So I'm assuming he does a pretty good job of screening those people out.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, I believe Dr. Johnson does do x-rays.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Yeah. But he never shows any of that.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  And he is a palmer grad.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Thanks for reminding everybody.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, Dan, is there anything that we didn't talk about? I know I sent you over a bunch of questions. We've come like the kitchen.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  I don't know. We got, you know, the project that my wife and I are working on is to help students succeed. The analogy I use is the school gives you the bricks that for you to build your house, but they don't do a great job of none of them do a great job of giving you the mortar. There's so much that you don't learn in a business class. There's so much you don't learn in interpersonal communications running in office, you know, negotiating contracts, reading contracts, dealing with attorneys, all kinds of things that if you are going to be, you're going to be associate, you're looking at a contract and you don't know if it's a good contract or not. You just are basically probably looking at dollars, just like everybody else. So we want to help give everybody the tools to succeed more right out of the box. And we're going to have other experts like, you know, Jim. We have, I just did an interview to friend up in Minnesota who he's got a big family and he's got a big practice and his family, his work and life interactions, his family did not suffer at all for him being there. He didn't teach a lot. Now he's starting to teach as they get older. They all come with its phenomenal, but we need more. If care practice going to deliver the promise that our philosophy should, it shouldn't just be in our nervous systems. It should be in every care practice life that we are, we're thriving in our with our families. We're thriving physically. We're thriving financially. All those things have to happen.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  The terms and conditions of a quality life.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Who I like that. I'm going to steal that from you. I'll give you full credit.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  And I believe that there are terms and conditions when it comes to fine fulfillment. I think a big part of becoming the chiropractor is a lot of fulfillment and actually getting the passage to practice. Then you get the pursuit of happiness. And then you have to start realizing who your identity is and how you want to craft your life within your identity. And I think a lot of times when people get to that next stage, they go coachless. They don't have a method to follow. They don't understand what their next terms and conditions of life are. And they get busy having families and starting practices or coming in associates. And the last thing that they're thinking about is, gosh, I have to read a contract.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  Yeah. Everything in your life should be intentional.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Well, Dr. Dan Lyon, your 592 of the Chiro Hustle podcast. Thanks for being our guest today.

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  I think I'll get a tattoo 592. Thanks for having me, Jim. Long time coming. I think I first met you at Mile High and then you put out that message. Anybody want to go to Mexico? And I said, yes. And so then we went down to Mexico together. Then I'm sitting at the party in Devonport. I don't know if that was 2019 or 2021 for Palmer Homecoming and all of a sudden you're standing next to me. What are you doing here? Because I'm from town. It's just a perfect example of you never know how far reaching something you may think say or do today will affect the lives of millions tomorrow. I mean, you're a living example of that.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Yeah. That's the power of connection. The power of storytelling. That's really what podcasting is. It's a storytelling and it's platforming. And if you deliver the truth well within this platform, it gives a huge amplifier to this big message and this big idea of chiropractic. And everywhere you go, people need a little bit more of this truth and they need a little bit more connection. Whether it's in Don Portaewa or the Gonstead clinic or the next mile high, I look forward to seeing you and reconnecting with you. If people wanted to reach out to you or book you or have you speak for them or join your program, where should we send them to?

DR DAN LYONS DC LCP DPHCS (GUEST):  You can, my email is dr. Dan at precisionchiroGB.com. PrecisionchiroGB.com for Green Bay. I didn't want to tell them. I let you tell them.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  So reach out to Dan Lyons at dr. Dan at precisionchiroGB.com. Welcome for your next speaking engagement. Check out his program with his wife Brooke. And I really appreciate you being on with this episode and looking forward to the next time.

JAMES CHESTER (HOST):  Thanks for listening to Chiro Hustle. Don't forget to subscribe and check back next week to continue hustling.

This episode is brought to you by…

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